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"Under God" in the Pledge
LiteSpeed
post Jul 12 2011, 11:45 PM
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So, for awhile now I've been hearing that "Under God" has always been in the pledge of allegiance, or that it hasn't but should stay, or that it has and shouldn't stay, etc. What are your beliefs on it? Should it stay? Should it go? Does it or does it not violate the First Amendment?

By the way, for those of you who think it's always been there, it hasn't. It was added in the '50s during a communist scare, I'm pretty sure because one of the leaders was atheist. Not quite sure if it was cause of the leader, but it was added in the 50s.


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Personally, I feel it should go. Not just because I'm atheist, but not EVERY religion calls their god, well, God.
I also believe that if it stays, it shouldn't be mandatory to say, as I have gotten in some minor trouble for simply staying quiet during the "Under God" part.


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WindexSniper
post Jul 13 2011, 12:00 AM
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I personally think it violates the first amendment. In my old school we got punished if we didn't say it. i felt really bad for this one Hindu kid in my class. I don't think it should be there.
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Keiiri
post Jul 13 2011, 12:31 AM
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I'm fine with it being there but I don't believe that anyone should be pressured into saying it, or punished for not saying it. It goes against freedom of Religion.


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roygbiv
post Jul 15 2011, 07:32 AM
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i always get in trouble for not saying the pledge,i aint praying to no flag.i think they should remove it completly.


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post Jul 15 2011, 07:34 AM
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QUOTE(Keiiri @ Jul 13 2011, 06:31 AM) *
I'm fine with it being there but I don't believe that anyone should be pressured into saying it, or punished for not saying it. It goes against freedom of Religion.


This.


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Reyo
post Jul 16 2011, 12:22 AM
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I believe that there are much more pressing matters to tend to than half a sentence. Saying the pledge every morning goes away after High School. Seriously...it does. You can fight all you want for them to take it out, but chances are it won't even BE taken out until you're well done with ever having to say it.

So you know what I advise? Don't say it. Don't be a little jerkoff and make an ass of yourself while everyone ELSE is saying it by causing a ruckus (like this one kid at my school did...) just say the pledge up until that part...skip it...go back to saying it. If the teacher decides to be a little whore jerk (because I know it happens), just say you were taking a breath. If they persist, well shit......sometimes teachers are assholes. I've had my fare share of dick teachers. They're inevitable. Besides, I know as much as you do that most of the time you're just thinking about that homework you didn't do...or that test you're about to take. I know because I did it, and it doesn't just happen with the pledge of allegiance. Once you devote saying it to muscle memory, you're mind is going to wander to ninja dinosaurs and robot pirates until it's done and you're like "oh shit...we're done". You're gonna be saying it for the next 4 years...and that's it, and I say "that's it" because 4 years isn't really that long a time in retrospect. Once you're done having to say it every morning, it'll hit you...it's also around the time you start feeling old. People your age (or younger) will be getting engaged, you'll realize that they canceled all of your favorite TV shows a good 5 years ago (and you didn't even notice it) etc, but I'm rambling......point is: it's not that big a deal. Really...it isn't.

And is it just me, or does this have the whole "PETA vs. the town of 'fishkill'" vibe to it?

This post has been edited by Reyo: Jul 16 2011, 12:29 AM


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Prelude
post Jul 30 2011, 11:27 PM
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I am in favour of "all or nothing." And since it isn't feasible to include all other deities, I think it should be removed. It's not that it offends me, but it basically promotes Christianity and any other God-religion and ignores every other one.

Same issue with the 9/11 cross memorial thing.


And if a public school has issues with anyone not saying the pledge, tell them you have no obligation to say it. If it's a private school, you're probably out of luck. I think they're allowed to have their own set of rules. But a public school can't enforce something so mundane as politely and respectfully sitting down for the pledge.


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Calming Madman
post Aug 9 2011, 09:18 PM
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*bites lip*

I'm in the Military I fight for that damn flag,I respect it in every way possible.


But that's not the case. God is real. If he wasn't why would we be here? I've always said 'Under God' in the Pledge.


@Rileyyup.

*stares at you*

HOW THE FUCK WOULD YOU LIKE IT IF ALQUEDA HELD YOU GUNPOINT? Exactly read a damn history book son.

Millions of Men and Women have fought for that flag. RESPECT IT.


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Reyo
post Aug 10 2011, 10:07 AM
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QUOTE(rileyup @ Jul 15 2011, 07:32 AM) *
i always get in trouble for not saying the pledge,i aint praying to no flag.i think they should remove it completly.





This post has been edited by Reyo: Aug 10 2011, 10:10 AM


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Lord Raven
post Aug 14 2011, 01:12 AM
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You know, this isn't some sort of spammy forum where you can go around and post a macro and just leave it at that. If you're going to post anything, at least contribute on top of that.

QUOTE(Heaven Falling @ Aug 9 2011, 10:18 PM) *
I'm in the Military I fight for that damn flag,I respect it in every way possible.
Petty nationalism. It may be a symbol for you, but to us it doesn't really mean anything. I live in this nation and I will continue to do so, I'm sure my loyalty is expressed more in that than anything.

QUOTE
But that's not the case. God is real. If he wasn't why would we be here? I've always said 'Under God' in the Pledge.
I don't even care if he's real, other people do not believe that he exists and that should be fine by you. If you fight for the flag, you also fight for the rights that protect one's right to not believe in god.

QUOTE
HOW THE FUCK WOULD YOU LIKE IT IF ALQUEDA HELD YOU GUNPOINT? Exactly read a damn history book son.
And this is where I ask you to calm down and take time to rationalize before you say anything.


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Reyo
post Aug 28 2011, 09:08 PM
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I just couldn't get over how rediculous it sounded, you're not "praying to a flag". You're not "praying" to anything, you're showing reverence to your country, and reflecting on the freedoms you have as a United States Citizen. You don't want to do that? I say again: "reflecting on the freedoms you have as a United States Citizen"

Either way it stands that there are definitely more dire things out there than "I don't want to say 'under God' in the pledge". If you don't want to say it, that's fine, but don't expect me to respect you if a) you start acting like an ass while other people are saying it because you're "expressing your right not to say it" or b) start whining that you shouldn't have to say it. Obviously, this thread isn't whining since it's a valid question to ask, but I've known people to sit there and beligerantly argue the point that they shouldn't have t say it when I say "...then don't say it?"

"BUT WHY DO I HAVE TO!?" isn't a very clever response to that...



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Larzsi
post Sep 4 2011, 07:04 PM
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QUOTE(Heaven Falling @ Aug 9 2011, 10:18 PM) *
But that's not the case. God is real. If he wasn't why would we be here? I've always said 'Under God' in the Pledge.

Lol so much for respecting the beliefs of others. Not very 'American', is it?


Anyways, I hate that it's in the pledge. It just proves even more that America isn't the "religion friendly" place it claims to be.


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PawsrentOrigin
post Sep 8 2011, 09:00 PM
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I request it be changed to my religion, "one nation, under Flying Spaghetti Monster, with blah blah blabitty blah blah blah blah." Ramenman.gif

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Reyo
post Sep 16 2011, 06:13 PM
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QUOTE(KyoushiroTheSilver @ Sep 4 2011, 07:04 PM) *
QUOTE(Heaven Falling @ Aug 9 2011, 10:18 PM) *
But that's not the case. God is real. If he wasn't why would we be here? I've always said 'Under God' in the Pledge.

Lol so much for respecting the beliefs of others. Not very 'American', is it?


Anyways, I hate that it's in the pledge. It just proves even more that America isn't the "religion friendly" place it claims to be.


I doubt the government put that in there as a foot in the face of anyone who doesn't believe in God. My guess is it's in there because the consensus religion of the group of people who came up with it was something related to God.

QUOTE(PawsrentOrigin @ Sep 8 2011, 09:00 PM) *
I request it be changed to my religion, "one nation, under Flying Spaghetti Monster, with blah blah blabitty blah blah blah blah." Ramenman.gif


Again?


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post Sep 16 2011, 06:26 PM
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QUOTE(PawsrentOrigin @ Sep 8 2011, 11:00 PM) *
I request it be changed to my religion, "one nation, under Flying Spaghetti Monster, with blah blah blabitty blah blah blah blah." Ramenman.gif


I am a pastafarian my self ... may he bless you all , ramen


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Calming Madman
post Sep 17 2011, 12:44 AM
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Hmm...How do you non-believers think we were created? MAGIC DUST?


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post Sep 17 2011, 01:52 AM
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While I'm not American, if I were, I would not agree with it being in the Pledge. It wasn't in there originally, and it shouldn't have been added.

If freedom of religion is used to keep it in there, what about those religions who don't pray to a God (Buddhism for example)? Does it not violate their freedom?


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post Sep 17 2011, 02:44 AM
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QUOTE(Rainbow Kang @ Sep 16 2011, 10:44 PM) *
Hmm...How do you non-believers think we were created? MAGIC DUST?
Magic dust? Are you kidding me? Haven't you ever heard of the Big Bang theory, and the whole idea of evolution?



But really, I don't see why it should be in the pledge either. When we say the pledge in school, I just don't say it. I find it a little bit sad that we can't just respect the beliefs of others and just remove it, though.

This post has been edited by Fatal Error: Sep 17 2011, 02:45 AM


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Calming Madman
post Sep 17 2011, 04:19 AM
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In My Perspective.

People from other countries and have different religion don't want to say it. That's fine by me.

But straight up Americans? No. Just No.


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post Sep 17 2011, 06:53 AM
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QUOTE(Rainbow Kang @ Sep 17 2011, 07:19 PM) *
But straight up Americans? No. Just No.


Riiight.

Because Americans are only Christian. :|


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