[X] My Assistant

[Kaname Madoka]

I completely agree with you there. There isn't a good reason to deny anyone the right to marry. Since Iowa and Vermont have legalized same-sex marriages, there has been a new commercial about how "A storm is gathering" and "rights are being taken away from heterosexual couples" which is complete bullshit. How is same-sex marriage taking away rights from heterosexual couples? And can you seriously tell me that denying two people the right to marry isn't taking away THEIR rights?

[eagleblackbelt]

Personally, if they would take away the word, "marriage," I would have a lot better feeling towards that. I really don't care if guys want to f**k other guys or if girls want to do the same to girls, but please don't call their union marriage. Personally, I feel it degrades the word of marriage for heterosexual couples.

I am against gays being allowed into the Boy Scouts however. I feel that it is an appropriate safety measure made for the interst of boys involved. If they want to be involved in a similar organization, why don't they form a "Gay Scouts" or something. Just don't infiltrate us.

[Lord Raven]

How does it degrade the word of marriage, exactly?
And 'safety measure'? lol wut...



You definitely need to explain yourself. A lot.

[Pokii]

I am against gays being allowed into the Boy Scouts however. I feel that it is an appropriate safety measure made for the interst of boys involved. If they want to be involved in a similar organization, why don't they form a "Gay Scouts" or something. Just don't infiltrate us.

Yeah, because every gay boy is attracted to every other boy on Earth, right?

[Kaname Madoka]

The thought that gay boys are somehow infiltrating your "pure" pool of boy scouts is a laughable notion, at best. I highly doubt that you hit on every girl you see, and it's the same for any homosexual person. They are normal citizens, and to think of them as anything less is just ridiculous.

Besides, I highly doubt that very many people are going to join Boy Scouts to find f*ckbuddies. Boy Scouts has a purpose and the vast majority of people who want to join are going to join for that purpose.

[Tiamat]

I look at this and I think people are missing something, at least for those in the US:

All men are equal in the eye of the law.

What does this mean? It means that everyone, regardless of sexuality, gender, race, or creed should be treated the same under the law. Marriage is, at least in the modern United States, an insitution of law. After all, you don't need a fancy religious ceremony to get married--you just need to sign papers and take oaths before a legal-type-person (I'd love the actual name of the profession--it... eludes me). Thus, you get benefits! Yay! But then you look at legal unions--hmm... same amount of legal crap, next to no benefits.

y helo thar social injustice, how r u today?

Not having universial* marriage is therefore, against the United States Constitution. Yes, the same document we practically worship. Does it matter that it's not what the Framers intended? After all, they didn't expect women or black men to be part of that "all men are created equal" thing. Very few of our interpretations are what the Framers intended. How is this any different? By instituting universal marriage, we are further progressing towards the American ideal--a place where everyone is identical in the eyes of the law, regardless of who they are. And while we might fall short, we should continue to try, so that everyone can rest assured that they will be protected from injustice while in the courtroom, at the very least. *hopes she makes sense; it's very late*

*Two consenting adults, factoring in incest laws. Yes, those exist.

[Dys Tuvai]

The way I see it, there is no reason why homosexual couples shouldn't get the same benefits heterosexual couples do - just like there is no reason why homosexual couples get all the flak they are getting from ignorant sods. Love is love, attraction is attraction, regardless of gender, biology or anything else really.

[Kai Reddtail]

What does this mean? It means that everyone, regardless of sexuality, gender, race, or creed should be treated the same under the law. Marriage is, at least in the modern United States, an insitution of law. After all, you don't need a fancy religious ceremony to get married--you just need to sign papers and take oaths before a legal-type-person (I'd love the actual name of the profession--it... eludes me). Thus, you get benefits! Yay! But then you look at legal unions--hmm... same amount of legal crap, next to no benefits.

I agree Tiamat. Oh, and by the way, their titles are "Justice of the Peace."

Eagleblackbelt:

"Degrades?" How? Please do explain. It's about love, it very simple. It doesn't mean that the heterosexual marriages are any less marriages, it just means that people are actually recognizing the validity of homosexual marriages as an equal bond of love.

If you want to see degradation of marriage, you should look towards heterosexual couples. I'm pretty sure it's already been said here, but I'm talking about things like Britney Spears 24Hr marriage.

I won't say anything on the boy scout matter here, since I already said my peice about that in your thread.

[Midnight Lycanro...]

I'm a girl and I love girls more the I do boys. If I love another girl more than anything in the whole world, she's the light of my life and I want to make her happy for the rest of my life, I feel like I should be able to do so. If I want to marry my soulmate, most times I can't. Why not? Because it's against the bible, mostly, even if they don't say it. Why else would love be "immoral"? How come I can't marry the love of my life in the place I live in, but two people can get married and hate each other?

That's how I feel.

[nebz5]

Yeah I'm for gay marriage. If there's a gay couple living next to you,you know how that affects your life, guess, that's right it doesn't. All it means is that there's gay people living next to you just because they're different from the norm doesn't make them some sort of monster or less of a human. Though personally I'm truly against marriage in the whole. All your really doing is paying someone money to have them tell you and someone else that the two of you are in love.

[Tatl]

I am against gays being allowed into the Boy Scouts however. I feel that it is an appropriate safety measure made for the interst of boys involved. If they want to be involved in a similar organization, why don't they form a "Gay Scouts" or something. Just don't infiltrate us.

Aside from agreeing with what was said in the last few posts about this, I'd like to point out that there are undoubtedly many, many, many gay boys in Boy Scouts as it is that just aren't open about it.

I think what you fail to understand, and what a lot of people fail to understand, is that homosexual people do the exact same things as heterosexual people... just, with their own gender. It's about loving each other, not about going out and getting as much sex as possible, "infiltrating" Boy Scouts to molest kids, or whatever else. Just as many heterosexual people are as likely to molest children as homosexual people.

[Tachaccoon]

Heh. It reminds me of a saying:

"Just because they're gay, doesn't mean they're looking at you. You're not that hot."

I have no idea why people have a problem with Gays getting married.
Really.

Here, Let me do a little skit:

Kid: LALALA I'M GOING TO SCHOOL LALALA
*kids goes past church having gay wedding*
*Kid stops*
Kid: OHMEHGAWD MEH FUTURE IS RUINED AND THIS COMPLETELY AFFECTS MY LIFE BECAUSE I PASSED BY A CHURCH THAT HAS GAY MARRIAGE!
*Kid Screams*
*Kid vomits spiders*
*Kid falls over in trama*

...Do you see the not-happing-ever from that?

[Kaname Madoka]

I lol'd.

[Kai Reddtail]

Tachaccoon, I applaud your excellent use of satirical humor to make a very valid point. Bravo!

[Atom]

I'll even share a few short examples:
Black history month. Not racist.
If we had a white history month, guess what? we'd be racist

Black only colleges. Not racist
White only colleges: they had those once and there were riots until they opened for everybody (equality)

Blacks only college funds: not racist.
White people sure as hell can't have those though because that's racist . . .

It goes both ways
And that's that.

It's racist because you're forgetting the amazingly heavy baggage that comes with white history, which is often presented as being the only history worth studying. Whites have a history of oppressing and taking advantage of anyone viewed as inferior. Black/Hispanic/etc History months are done in order to highlight the accomplishments of historically and presently oppressed and obscured minorities. They're done in order to REMIND people that everyone is equal and that they have the right to be proud of themselves and celebrate their people's histories even if they are not white. You are talking from an incredibly privileged position.

Heh. It reminds me of a saying:

"Just because they're gay, doesn't mean they're looking at you. You're not that hot."

I have no idea why people have a problem with Gays getting married.
Really.

Here, Let me do a little skit:

Kid: LALALA I'M GOING TO SCHOOL LALALA
*kids goes past church having gay wedding*
*Kid stops*
Kid: OHMEHGAWD MEH FUTURE IS RUINED AND THIS COMPLETELY AFFECTS MY LIFE BECAUSE I PASSED BY A CHURCH THAT HAS GAY MARRIAGE!
*Kid Screams*
*Kid vomits spiders*
*Kid falls over in trama*

...Do you see the not-happing-ever from that?

I lol'd.


And personally, as a gay person, I obviously support gay marriage. However, what I would love to see is the government providing civil unions to everyone whether gay, straight, bisexual, whatever, and the churches being in charge of marriage. If a church doesn't want to marry my girlfriend and I, so be it. I'll go somewhere else. I will still have my legal documents stating I am in a union with someone.

I am sick to death of the argument that being gay is not "natural" and wrong because it gays don't procreate. Would you deny marriage to infertile couples? To couples who simply choose not to have children? And frankly, humanity has strayed worlds away from being "natural". Look at it this way: You are using the internet, on a computer (a man-made machine), that uses electricity generated by other man-made machines, inside a man-made house, which most likely also uses electricity, has air-conditioning, at least one tv, a microwave, a refridgerator, radio, beds with bedframes, books, glasses, dvds, cds, videogames, toys, clothing, etc. None of these things occur naturally in the world. So shut up with your "it's not natural" argument.

None of what you do except crap, sleep, eat, and screw are natural.

[Pokii]

All right childrens, listen up. The reason that people can't agree on gay marriage is simple and I'm about to explain it for those of you who haven't gotten it yet.

Coming from growing up in a house run by demi-rich Conservative Christian Republican white people, I can tell you honestly and truly why Christians will kill you over the subject of "gay marriage." The reason is quite simple: it says in the Bible that marriage is a sacrament; that is to say that it is a sacred ritual of two people coming together as one, which is specifically stated that it is to consist of one man and one woman.

So see, half the time it's not even two people of the same sex being together (though a lot of times it is...), but the whole issue they have against "gay marriage" is the "marriage" part. They believe that since it's a man and a man or a woman and a woman, they feel it's "degrading" (to quote EBB) to the "sacrament" of marriage which, because the Bible said so, therefore makes it a sin, which therefore makes a lot of them just hate gay people period. But if it wasn't called gay marriage, hell, half the people probably wouldn't even care anymore...

So see, once again it's not really an argument over a law or principle, it's an argument over a definition.

[Zoreta]

Of course, it is also considered a sin if you don't offer your daughters to your male guests as entertainment in the laws of hospitality. It is also a sin if you shave, or wear clothing of mixed fabric, or eat shellfish or swine.

Just because it was considered a sin then, doesn't mean it should be considered one now.

[Lord Raven]

That makes no sense though because the church should have shit to do with government, especially considering not everyone's a fucking Christian, and it actually violates the first amendment to base a law upon a religious policy -- a religion not everyone shares.

[Zoreta]

Yes, but because we are a democracy, and a majority of the population is Christian, Christian ideas wriggle their way in. Unfortunately, the only way to get around it is to use the amendments already in place to overturn things like Prop 8, and overturning laws takes a lot of time.

[Pokii]

That makes no sense though because the church should have shit to do with government, especially considering not everyone's a fucking Christian, and it actually violates the first amendment to base a law upon a religious policy -- a religion not everyone shares.

Well, that depends on where you live, I'd imagine. Though you're using America for your example, so that works...

For us Americans, our country was founded by Puritan Christians who were basically rejected from England as trash and decided to form a new nation however they pleased (by stealing land from the natives who were already there, like most empires). But people seem to forget that this nation was indeed originally founded as a primarily Christian nation, though it was certainly still one where you could be whatever you wanted to be. It's just that times have changed and the "whatever else you want to be" has caught up with Christianity and they don't seem to like the shift in balance ("balance" being a very lax word in this particular context).

But I guess this is sort of off-topic now =\